So you take it, everybody wants a shot at moving up. this is my first job out of college, thus my complete lack of knowledge on how to deal, thanks for any help. Institutions are advised to complete and submit an HR31 request formto the relevant HR School Team to request, amend or extend an additional responsibility payment. Take the position and begin shopping. But even if there is no change, I could see there might be reasons why OP might want to take the promotion with no change in price. However it seems people who are hard workers, willing to stay late, log on at home, or work weekends for free are given more tasks, more responsibility, and harder jobs. Words are wind. Right now I'm working for a subcontractor making $44720, just got offered a promotion which will switch me over to the main contractor and they only offered $44800, I looked through the benefits package and there's not enough there to switch just based off the pay and benefits, but the subcontractor I'm currently with has some issues I can't tolerate for much longer. "Hang in there until we finish this project and we'll take care of you on the next one", or "We'll take care of you at the end of the year" Basically they expect you to keep "chasing a carrot" like a donkey pulling a cart. Also, for developmental reasons it might be worth it. My first job was one of these... do a good job and the boss says "That's really good! OP is "underpaid 30k" already what makes you think more responsibility will all of a sudden pay off? Classic bullshit. If you do the same, people (bosses, friends, etc.) Join our community, read the PF Wiki, and get on top of your finances! If they say no, then decline the promotion. Is it unfair to pay two different employees a different wage or remuneration for the same work? You're not negotiating unless you're willing to walk away. Find more ways to say responsibility, along with related words, antonyms and example phrases at Thesaurus.com, the world's most trusted free thesaurus. An increase in responsibility will pay off in one of two ways: you do great work, and your boss shows gratitude by making it a "promotion" and making it official. there's not enough there to switch just based off the pay and benefits, but the subcontractor I'm currently with is absolutely horrible. Hey, maybe he'll be CEO someday, but currently it doesn't seem like his efforts are paying off. If you know others doing the same thing you are doing at other companies make over 25k more, and they want you you to do more, make them come up with a title and a promise of a raise later AT LEAST. Is there any room for negotiation on the salary? Why aren’t they tipped? I'd certainly try to negotiate for better pay ("I'm interested in the promotion, but it seems like a significant increase in responsibilities for $80 a year, I feel x is more in line with the job requirements, is there any wiggle room in the salary?" Saying, “I can do it only if you give me more money,” is saying, “It’s possible, but I’m only willing to try for more money.” Been in similar situations twice in my life. You're not negotiating unless you're willing to walk away from the promotion. Including multiple jobs from the same company on your resume is tricky. It takes some cost/benefit analysis, and every situation is different. Several times over it's happened to me and others I've worked with. BREAK THE CYCLE! Then 6 months, then a year, then another 6 months go by and you're torn because you know you should quit them but you've worked so hard and you just know they wouldn't do that to you. For example, say you work in HR, but you’ve been asked to attend some marketing-related conferences because that team is short-staffed. They are serving the public in an establishment that’s disgusting compared to your restaurant. He just mindlessly keeps at it. A healthy work/life balance, an acceptable amount of work, good benefits, a positive work environment, and a clearly defined reward system, all help keep employees happy. Works 7 days a week, stays late every night, then logs on at home. When you tell them "you've got to get me some help" and "it's time for a raise" it's always. They Are Self-Disciplined The amended Equal Pay Act prohibits an employer from paying any of its employees wage rates that are less than what it pays employees of the opposite sex, or of another race, or of another ethnicity for substantially similar work, when viewed as a composite of skill, effort, and responsibility, and performed under similar working conditions. I've been there. I've been in similar situations. It can be dangerous to agree to more if it impacts your ability to satisfy the job requirements that you were hired to do. Here in our company, I'm in my late 20's along with 90% of the department. People yell at them constantly. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. A month later, after successfully completing X every day, they tell you how good you are. (sometimes the lateral move explanation is because the boss is a bit of a dick; but often it's so they can move you back in a few months without a huge loss of face if you aren't up to the new role.). One co-worker even took a demotion in order to avoid additional responsibilities. OP: I would say something to them like "I enjoy what I'm doing and who I'm working with now, and I'm learning a lot. One thing I might consider is my "friend's" motive in telling me this. One reason may be to get some experience, a better looking title in the CV, and then to jump ship. a promotion will switch me over to the main contractor. I mean REALLY busting his butt. I think what the OP needs to ask for is the headcount to get the work accomplished. Hard work is generally rewarded over time. Do some research and see what others are being paid to preform the same responsibilities. Aaargh. … Such as growth. Never work for free. You should normally expect an employer to offer more pay when they are asking you to perform work over and above your normal duties, particularly if this involves extra hours. I'll tell you exactly what that means. New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast, More posts from the personalfinance community. Additional Responsibility Payments are made to employees who are taking on additional responsibilities over and above those set out in their job description and at a higher level, with the agreement of their institution. This happens if you've been promoted or changed positions with an employer. I have been told many times to research what others in my field are making, but it's not a "real job" in the sense that I can't look up what others are making who do the same work. And now, you're ready to take on more. Especially for a first job out of college, a much more important question should be where will he learn the most? When you finally get too much of it and take up for yourself, they act incredulous, tell you you're not a team player, and your days are numbered because they will already have someone else in mind to pull the same crap on. I understand exactly where you're at and a good worker and a good guy wants to work hard and do a good job but THAT is exactly what they take advantage of. Goes to fancy meetings, literally runs around the office doing tasks. I received a promotion last year that had increased responsibilities and no pay raise. We don’t tip people who work at McDonalds, though. Another word for responsibility. As long as he doesn't go hardball about it and endanger the opportunity or piss off a potential employer that he might cross paths with for decades to come, I think it's totally reasonable to try to negotiate. In some companies, it might be around the anniversary of your start date. If OP doesn't get a raise, then there really isn't a promotion, just added responsibilities. Typically raises follow the increase in responsibility. If they say no, then decline the promotion. How To Explain Why You Want A Lower-Paying, Lesser-Responsibility Job Peggy McKee. Both times I've played ball - took the responsibilities and worked hard despite the immediate lack of promotion. What you are entitled to be paid depends on the express terms of your contract of employment. The unfortunate answer to your question is that it is likely your employer can increase your duties without giving you a raise. That just around the bend they'll make it right. It would be foolish to take on more responsibility with more work without getting better compensation. That said, there aren't that many times when you can get a pay jump just by speaking up, and starting a new job is one of those times. If this happens then you will really know what it's like to "feel manipulated and taken advantage of". [say this stuff even if it isn't true] This would be an easy decision if there was a clear pay rise involved, but there isn't. "Hey if this works out, 6 months from now I'm going to expect (a couple bucks an hour raise, whatever)" If he won't agree to that, and you take it, don't be surprised when all your extra hard work gets you nothing but more hard work. perform the same job (equal work) do not get paid the same for the same work (unequal pay) While a claim may be made by an employee based upon the above criteria, an employer can dispute the claim on the grounds that the higher earner has more experience or has seniority and if he can prove this then it will mean that the claim is defeated. If they don't play ball, that's the time you use that extra responsibility to update your CV and find another employer. My friend told me that my boss has no plans to give me a raise or a promotion (hence the "lateral move" thing.) First off, is that even normal? What if we are in a job that is a very new position, with only a handful of people in the industry doing that job? That way at least if they screw you later and never come up with the money, you have a better title on your resume and when interviewing with prospective employers and they ask why you want to leave your current job you can look them in the eye and say "They gave me a promotion a year and a half ago, I took on the extra responsibility and workload in exchange for a promise of a raise after a year. You do the job first the money comes second. Being made to do more work without more pay is certainly unfair, and there are many things about employment that are unfair. If I had to pinpoint it, I’d say this curious phenomenon had its origins with the financial crisis of 2008, and it hasn’t abated since the economy has picked back up. By using our Services or clicking I agree, you agree to our use of cookies. Also remember that every employment contract contains implied duties of trust and confidence, and good faith. Such as growth. Question: I have a friend who is being given more responsibilities at work but is still being given the same pay. It's happened to me and several other good but naive people I've worked with. By using our Services or clicking I agree, you agree to our use of cookies. Of course, until very recently, there was no affordable public health insurance option, and the only feasible way for most Americans to afford insurance was through their employer. Cookies help us deliver our Services. If the title looks better on a resumé it could be a stepping-stone and there are some things that can be learned that would make OP more valuable to a future employer, it could be an investment of sorts. More often than not it does NOT pay off. 10. I agree with Thunderous. This is exactly correct. We do a very specific job for a govt office and the position I'm jumping to is a new one that started a month ago. Learn about budgeting, saving, getting out of debt, credit, investing, and retirement planning. Learn about budgeting, saving, getting out of debt, credit, investing, and retirement planning. I worked out the numbers etc and what they were giving me wasn't enough to take on more responsibilities. The company reneged on the agreement" and take another job making the 30 to 45k difference it would be by that time. The reasons for this are manifold. Quit, apply for new job, repeat. Roughly 39 percent of HR managers today say it is completely common for them to offer an employee a promotion without a pay increase. Just to further expand on this, obviously I'd say accept the new responsibilities and ramp up your work and give 110% as much as you can. I think this is the thinking of someone working a string of entry level jobs rather than someone looking to build a career. Be both patient and diligent. They’re doing almost the same thing. A few months pass by, you're training the new guy, and glancing over at his contract, realize he's getting the exact same pay you are getting, for doing about 10% as much work. How do i do research on that exactly? If the subcontractor OP is currently working for is difficult to work for, it might actually be a more comfortable environment, even if there are more duties/responsibilities if the environment is better (though it's up to OP to do some research and see how the morale of people who work for that contractor is). As I said, I work for a big corporation, and I imagine that there must be systems in place to prevent this sort of thing from happening? While Government is different than the Private sector, sometimes due to various factors, companies won't give out pay raises at various times of the year. Like I said I know exactly how you feel. They may have worked in the same department for decades and are satisfied with the small annual pay increases, and they shied away from or even refused more responsibility when they could. They do this shit all the time. I would take on extra responsibility for the same pay if it significantly improved my work environment. When I work with young team leaders I often ask them to do same; leave the team - in your case your organisation - alone for a while and see how they operate without them. (According to a Careerbuilder.com survey from 2009, 47% of employees surveyed were taking on the work of 2 or more people for no additional pay). Press J to jump to the feed. Cookies help us deliver our Services. In fact, there are only a number of limited circumstances where an employer could not do this. 1. When an employee earns more than his or her supervisor, it is normally because the employee’s technical skills are worth more than those of the supervisor. Employer is going to have a change in heart and decide to be generous all of a sudden? They will let you do the work of 5 guys as long as you will do it. Some HR managers noted that there may be pay disparity between two people performing the same job because one was hired at a time when market demand for his or her skills was lower than it is now. Either way good luck and make the most out of the situation. If you have employees who want to work additional jobs for extra pay, you need to … Do the extra work, update your resume -- if it pays off soon, great, if not, take the updated resume elsewhere. A year later, the two of us who accepted the responsibility received a sizable pay increase and the guy who turned it down received nothing and basically screwed his chances at advancement. You can now market yourself with the new title, ask another company for the salary you want, and cherry on the top is telling your boss about how it's not selling him out, its just a lateral move. you do great work, your boss takes advantage of it... but now you have a stronger resume, and you can go get more money someplace else. So help? I make a decent salary, objectively speaking, but I make 30K below the average annual salary for my city/position... At any rate, a friend who works in management informed me that my boss is in the process of giving me a new role/title. Example: This one guy here has been busting his butt for 1-2 years longer than I have. Then when you've had enough of it, they don't come up with any money, and you're looking for a job when you've been doing a manager's job with no manager's pay and no manager's position. Source: I have hired many employees and observed their behavior. And unofficially oversee != manage. Do some research and see what others are being paid to preform the same responsibilities. 2 jobs can be vastly different based exclusively on cost of living, and you'd look very dumb if you went in and asked for a New York raise, while living in a small mid-west city. Then go in and say I will accept the promotion for x amount of dollars. This is a non-monetary reason to consider the "promotion". I agree completely. If all you're looking for in a job is to maximize the amount of money you make, I think you're in for fairly middling professional success. And once you take the bait you'll work your ass off, and keep working your ass off. He's right on track as the rest of us are and doesn't get any more compensation for his efforts. Try these tips. Of course, I would still shop around and negotiate as much as possible. Some people can be hired into an office that's been perfectly fine for years and within two weeks turn it into a festering hellhole with unfounded gossip that takes years to repair. He has been with his job for 4 years and has not been given a pay raise. While it could turn out like it did for Thunderous, that doesn't happen as often as you get the shaft. Few weeks later I was given a raise and still had the same position as before....the raise was the amount of $$ they were gonna give me as a promo. It may seem like an obvious yes, but the answer is actually no, says Sage Pastel Payroll & HR. It either works out great at the current firm or it works out great at a new firm. Remember, it's business not personal. He's calling it a "lateral move" (presumably to get out of paying me more money,) but he's expecting me to fulfill all of my current responsibilities, plus giving me more work and more responsibility, including managerial duties. This all the way. At my recent appraisal, my work had glowing feedback and it was acknowledged I did far more than was originally in my job description, but I was told I would not get a pay … Anonymous * November 20, 2012 at 2:12 pm. I'll be second-in-command to the head of the department, and I'll unofficially "oversee" (a modifier for "manage") two employees. Some of the terms and conditions of your employment include an employee’s title, pay, working hours, work location, or job responsibilities. I agree. There's a big difference between a technical team lead and the guy that makes hiring/firing/performance evaluations, and you won't know the difference until you get there. Because they are paid minimum wage! They prey on your desire to advance with this "we need you to move up, but we can't give you a title or a raise, but you do a good job at this for us and we'll take good care of you in the future". They want to you take on a lot more work, for no money. I realize that I always have the option of looking for another job, but I'm happy where I am; I just don't want to feel manipulated and taken advantage of. I wouldn't do it. And second to that, what sets him on the course he wants to take through his life? Be aware that if you decline the promotion the company could get mad and let you go. For further information or advice please contact your HR School Team. It would be foolish to take on more responsibility with more work without getting better compensation. Do i just ask if theres a window of negotiability here? https://www.reddit.com/r/personalfinance/comments/49lq6h/my_corporate_boss_is_planning_to_give_me_way_more/d0tnm42. Others have started, gotten treated similarly, and bailed for new jobs for more money. Better to be at the bottom of the ladder you want to climb than the top of one you can't stand and all that. I'm in my late 20's. Promotions and increases in pay only really come from time with the company and working harder, longer, or better at least here doesn't result in pay increases or promotions. Everybody else missed the part where you said "lateral" they aren't even giving him a better title. People fight almost daily in the place that they work. If the alternative is being fired, which it very often is, then how foolish it is depends entirely on OPs financial situation and how quickly he or she could find new employment. More Responsibility At Work, Same Pay Getting more responsibility at work for the same pay doesn't mean you're being treated poorly and deserve a raise. Edit: i know it's annoying but I can only give out so many details, trying to keep my security clearance. Specifically the EPA provides that employers may not pay unequal wages to men and women who perform jobs that require substantially equal skill, effort and responsibility, and that are performed under similar working conditions within the same establishment. I would love to hear your thoughts on this: https://www.reddit.com/r/personalfinance/comments/49lq6h/my_corporate_boss_is_planning_to_give_me_way_more/d0tnm42. There is no window unless you make a window. More and more work comes in from new products, new ventures, etc.. and we're all expect to do more. Press J to jump to the feed. Great in theory. Sure, sometimes you’re going to be asked to go above and beyond your duties, and you’ll have to comply because that’s just part of being a team player. However it seems people who are hard workers, willing to stay late, log on at home, or work weekends for free are given more tasks, more responsibility, and harder jobs. Not always true. are much less likely to get mad, and more likely to work with you to fix the issue. Join our community, read the PF Wiki, and get on top of your finances! A Lack of Work… You've been there less than a year. Ive never done this before, even when i started they seemed to be the type who just try to talk fast and overwhelm you to the point that you cant get a word in, much less a negotiation. Agreed with you completely on this. I was one of three who received it, one turned it down because it did not come with higher pay. This alone summarizes your post. You control your own path in life. Patiently waited while busting my ass. When Your Primary Job Responsibilities Will Suffer. Basically if you let them shit on you, they will keep shoveling more and more shit on you. Played ball, busted my ass for years, and got nothing for it. March 7, 2011 Pay for Employees Performing More than One Job Q&A. I was hired three years ago as a customer service representative and my responsibilities were to answer the phone, do light filing, data entry and sales. And whether he's telling my reactions to this news to others in management. I'm trying to figure out what to say when I have the meeting with him --which is where you guys come in. Continue kicking ass and either 1) good things will happen when you ask for them or 2) you get out after year 2. If you work for a company that generally gives raises once a year, pay attention to when that normally happens. In my experience if you take on the extra work, it just becomes expected. So you’re doing a good job at work. If you really trust your boss, and you really want to do it, at least make him promise you something concrete. it's not selling him out, its just a lateral move. Why? More and more often, people are being asked to do more for the same pay. Career expert Lindsey Pollak says it … They offered it yesterday and I got an extra day to consider, so I shouldve posted this yesterday but I didn't think about it. Unless you're lucky enough to have a ridiculously cool boss, letting them take advantage of you will only encourage them to continue taking advantage of you in teh future. Thank you! 40% of respondents to Glassdoor’s Q3 2015 employment confidence survey said that they value health insurance more than a pay raise. Never work for free. I was offered a promo last year or 2 years ago. But do be keen on seeing where this is going over the next few months and if there is any promotion, bonus, or increase in pay on the way. Increasing Responsibilities, Same Pay. I declined. A good place to compare what others are making, with a degree, in a certain location, with a bunch of other variables is (payscale.com)[payscale.com]. Always ask questions. That's normal in a way, but more tasks and duties are piled on these people until they eventually just break, quit, and get other jobs. More and more work comes in from new products, new ventures, etc.. and we're all expect to do more. If they want me to do more shit, they better pay more right off the bat. They want you to work yourself ragged trying to impress them. and if they can't/won't budge on salary, see if they can offer more paid time off.). But be sure to take into account cost of living too. February 23, 2016. There are two ways to format your resume to reflect your multiple positions: stack the job titles under the employer's name, or create separate position descriptions. Others might assess everyone’s salary at the same time, like each December, often tied to your employer’s fiscal year and budget process. I work in Government, and usually this responsibility is given to people with higher grade than I am. Can't say the same will happen for you, but if it doesn't, worst case scenario is that you can update your resume and post out with a new skillset that makes you more marketable for higher level jobs. The idea behind is that the managers don't want to pay more for the same job, unless the absence of person causes troubles and they want to avoid the further problems. Now you can do X task.". Show you can do more for a few months, and then ask for a raise based on the higher responsibility. ", New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast, More posts from the personalfinance community. Promise and promise about "tomorrow" and tomorrow never comes. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. Which you should have been making the whole time. Promises don't put food on the table. I've been working for a big corporation for close to a year, and I've been told that everyone is very happy with my performance.